Mutt Motorcycles

[dogfish]

Has anyone owned and ridden their bikes? Quite tempted to get one, specifically an Akita250. However, I don't seem to find much information online from actual owners. I've only seen reviews from people who are testing it. Curious about what owners feel after having the bike for more than a year.

[Rozvent]

On 11/8/2021 at 12:25 PM, dogfish said:

Has anyone owned and ridden their bikes? Quite tempted to get one, specifically an Akita250. However, I don't seem to find much information online from actual owners. I've only seen reviews from people who are testing it. Curious about what owners feel after having the bike for more than a year.

Did you end up buying it?

[adesmond2]

On 11/8/2021 at 12:25 PM, dogfish said:

Has anyone owned and ridden their bikes? Quite tempted to get one, specifically an Akita250. However, I don't seem to find much information online from actual owners. I've only seen reviews from people who are testing it. Curious about what owners feel after having the bike for more than a year.

street cafe look...

1 hour ago, Rozvent said:

Did you end up buying it?

I think alot of people rather go with popular models then change abit to looks like cafe bike.. ^_^

If you really like that outlook.. go with Harley or there's one more model that one our of minister ride.. My friends ended up buying that.. can't recall that model out of sudden.. let me fb check..

Royal Enfield! Can't recall this brand cuz I seldom "check" this bike also.. haha..

https://www.royalenfield.com/sg/en/motorcycles/meteor-350/

this is the one he brought.. at least more support and etc..  

[Rozvent]

13 minutes ago, adesmond2 said:

street cafe look...

I think alot of people rather go with popular models then change abit to looks like cafe bike.. ^_^

If you really like that outlook.. go with Harley or there's one more model that one our of minister ride.. My friends ended up buying that.. can't recall that model out of sudden.. let me fb check..

Royal Enfield! Can't recall this brand cuz I seldom "check" this bike also.. haha..

https://www.royalenfield.com/sg/en/motorcycles/meteor-350/

this is the one he brought.. at least more support and etc..  

Yeah the mutt is to me the best looking class 2b bikes around. In Singapore 2A also not much options. And nowadays even Japanese made bikes looks very plasticky and pretty much boring/common. Chinese bike parts can get easily from Taobao while Japanese parts usually more expensive and longer waiting times.

 

And yes most cafe racer are more towards 2A above, 2B at most is Yamaha xsr155 and Kawasaki w175.

[adesmond2]

On 1/9/2023 at 4:46 PM, Rozvent said:

Yeah the mutt is to me the best looking class 2b bikes around. In Singapore 2A also not much options. And nowadays even Japanese made bikes looks very plasticky and pretty much boring/common. Chinese bike parts can get easily from Taobao while Japanese parts usually more expensive and longer waiting times.

 

And yes most cafe racer are more towards 2A above, 2B at most is Yamaha xsr155 and Kawasaki w175.

indeed.. go with your feel and see what you really want.. Adapt your motorcycle or adapt yourself..

 

[Rozvent]

On 1/11/2023 at 12:15 PM, adesmond2 said:

indeed.. go with your feel and see what you really want.. Adapt your motorcycle or adapt yourself..

 

Just to update and provide my honest feedback. Disclaimer this is my thoughts on this so no right or wrong. The reader can decided for themselves.

I got the mutt for about 2,700Km~ mileage and 6 months of ownership. Sold it off after that. It was good learning experience for me so I know but it was a painful one. Now this is just my experience and opinion so don't use mine to make a decision. What doesn't work for me may work for you

 

TLDR: In my opinion Buying a Mutt in SG is like buying a Nokia 3210 mobile phone today at iPhone 14 pro Max prices, but without the iPhone 14 tech or features. I'm sure not many of us would pay $2.5k for a Nokia 3210 today when you can get a used one probably on carousell if you just want to keep it as nostalgia. Or just buy and iPhone vs a Nokia 3210.

Whenever something rattles or sounds off on the mutt, I just keep telling myself it's the "retro vibes" or part of the retro experience, or "self healing bikes" to justify my purchase, or at least that was what I did for the duration of my purchase to keep me sane until I woke up from the matrix. After I got over the bike looks and the mindset to justify my purchase, I realised it's not a wise decision to buy one unless you really are into the cafe racer/retro look for the long term. Especially with bike prices in Singapore, you really need to know what you buying unless you're rich.

When you buy a retro bike, you get the looks but you have to sacrifice comfort, and practicality. The bike won't look good with a proper practical top box, and those retro panniers/saddle bags pretty much pointless yet pricey. I had to carry a large bag all the time like I was gonna do a parachute jump cos need to bring raincoat, laptop, work essentials, and yes a tool kit, fuses and zip ties as things keeps coming loose or random issues on the bike.

Just some of the issues I had below within a short span of 6 months ownership(mind you not even with heavy riding, just back and fro to home and office which is 7km distance mon to Fri). Also bear in mind the bike machine price when you reading the issues below so you can see whether you can stomach the issues at this price point(i.e. machine price of SGD$10.5K at Dec 2022 when I bought it for the 250cc Razorback model):

1) Clutch cable routing wasn't done properly so when the bike is parked on handlebar lock towards the left,the clutch cable would hit the exhaust. So it melted the clutch cable housing. Luckily I noticed the Burning smell so I used a cable tie to secure it to the frame. Problem solved, but it's a new bike right out the shop, just a few days after owning it when I noticed this. They claim to have a 32 PDI(aka post delivery inspection) check so how come they missed this Back then I was still in the honeymoon phase with the mutt so I just didn't think much about this issue. It was however a start of red flags.

2) The bike front fender serves no practical purpose, your face and front of your shirt will get wet with road water especially during rainy weather or after the rain. Your helmet visor can block the water hitting your face but it will leave a line of water mark on your visor. Really annoying to deal with. But looks good on the bike can't lie. 

3) The cable clamps on the front fork(which off my memory seemed to be for routing the Speedo cable nicely and not having it turn and twist while riding), didn't came on the bike when it was supposed to. The mech only realised after looking at the other bike models. So strange like I thought this would be caught during the "32 PDI check"

4) IU unit cable that was connected to the one of the battery terminal came loose rendering the IU unit unusable, awkward moment where your ride around with new cool looking bike then go to carpark gantry but the gantry never open, Malu Sia. That day I wanted to ride free and easy so didn't carry tools. And this happened so couldn't remove the seat to reconnect the cable. You have to use a spanner or wrench to remove the bolt under seat to access the battery.

4) Bike suddenly had power outage while riding, it was really sudden, power was off momentarily and caused the engine to turn off too while in gear, so when it happened engine braking kicked in which gave me a shock. Had to immediately clutch in to let it free wheel and while free wheeling thats where I noticed the dash had no power. So while free wheeling and clutched in, I kept pressing the electric start button a few times and it started back up. All this while riding. That was some quick thinking there.

5) Bike was supposed to come with a toolkit under the seat or at the side panel(depending on your model). The manual that they give you upon the bike collection at the shop states this if I remember correctly. Yet it wasn't there, had to ask to get one. Wasn't a good kit too, seems very cheapo shopee type.

6) My bike was supposed to come with a silver side metal/aluminium covers near the seat area but I got black ones instead. Not a big deal but I thought the 32 PDI check would pick this up. But it didn't affect anything and the looks wasn't that bad regardless. Oh well.

7) Left front fork bottom bolt was loose. Just tightened it myself with an allen key.

8 ) Rode in heavy rain for a few days straight, noticed that signal lights and dash was wonky. The signal lights sometimes didn't turn on when needed, and for the dash it showed I was riding at 333km/h in 3rd gear( like wth). 

9) Did a booking to go over to the shop to have the above issue#8 checked, but shop said that there was a glitch in their booking system so didn't know I was coming and had no mech onsite. Wasted trip but I think it's an honest mistake so oh well. The issue above rectified itself, which would mean the moisture in the bike electricals was dried up after a few days in the sun. Waterproofing electricals are not so good with the Mutt it seems.

10) During riding, one of the sump guard bolts(the protective metal piece under the bike engine) dropped. Not a major problem as still got 3 bolts holding it in place.

11) Went for the first servicing, already informed them I needed one sump guard bolt replacement along with the engine oil change. They did the servicing without the bolt replacement. I trusted them and didn't double check. Upon riding back home, 2 more bolts from the sump guard dropped. Just left one bolt hanging on for dear life. Had to come back to the shop to get it fixed. All FOC due to warranty but it is annoying to have informed them but still never do on the first round. And this was where I noticed this bike really requires bolt check/tightening like once a week. I know it's single cylinder engine so it will have vibrations, and things would get loose but man once a week of tightening huh, how to enjoy riding while constantly worrying about bolts and nuts falling off. I was hoping Mutt would be not like the usual made in china quality bike but it ends up like it is at this point  I buy a lot of made in china products so I'm definitely not against Chinese goods. In fact I love them but Mutt wasn't on par. This is also the point where I started to face my demons/mid-life crisis self that this wasn't a wise purchase

12) After around the 2,500km~ mileage point, the headlamp position light blew. To be fair the bike came with a halogen bulb as stock so I know it won't last as long as LED. But at just a short mileage and I had to get a replacement is kinda annoying. It was replaced under warranty so FOC, but the bulb used for the replacement was even dimmer then the stock one. But at this point my heart was already gone with the Mutt and the shop. So I didn't care already as I was already looking for a new bike from here on

My advise to others planning to get a Mutt:

1) Remember the machine price of the Mutt. They're not cheap. There's a lot of other worth while options like zontes or CF Moto out there that offer way more. Not all China bikes are bad, do a test ride on a Mutt and then compare a test ride with Zontes. You will be amazed on the price and the things you get with the Zontes as stock unlike the Mutt. I'll explain more in my next reply post here. 

2) They are not of great build quality. Be prepared to get your hands dirty to fix things. However you will learn to be resourceful so this could also be a plus point if you like tinkering with things, but if the bike is under warranty don't do so as it may void it. However parts are cheap if you know how to get them on taobao. But it also raises another question, if parts are cheap then why is the bike so expensive then?

3) Cafe racers are meant for looks, you must understand this. It's not meant for long rides, touring or performance machines. If you are into this look and foresee this to be the case long term then yes this could be a good option for you.

4) Please realize that once you throw you leg over on any bike, you won't see what your bike looks like. From here, what matters would be the ride quality(performance and comfort). The only visuals you would see is the handlebars, mirrors, fuel tank, dash. In short most bikes looks the same or typical once you sit on it. Ask yourself how often do you get to see your bike in its entirety, well for the most part is while the bike is idle on its stand. Unless you like riding pass glass panels or bus doors to check yourself out on the bike If you like short rides and spend most of the time just staring at the bike then this could be for you. 

5) This is an easy bike to maintain or fix. So don't be too in awe when the mech fixes it. You are to expect high service standards from them and nothing less as this are really simple bikes. If they do struggle to fix it then that would be worrying. Especially for the 125cc versions of the mutt, it's really easy and cheap(when you DIY) to change the oil, oil filter, spark plug, air filter, valve clearance, clutch cable, throttle cable, replacing the electronic components(e.g. TPS, lambda/O2 sensor, ignition coil, fuel injector, fuel pump, fuel level gauge, battery, fuses, head lamp bulbs). I have owned a Lexmoto prior which uses the same engine model as the Mutt 125cc types so I can speak from experience here. If I can do these with little experience anyone can. So what this mean here is that buying a mutt would mean it's easy on the pocket for maintenance especially once you learn how to do a lot of the routine things yourself(there's so many videos on YouTube). However, you would lose out on the savings here if you are too reliant on the shop. Of course this is only applicable after warranty is over.

6)Do some research on Mutt or retro bikes in general. Lookup retro bikes in Alibaba. You might find bikes that looks so similar to some of Mutt ranges. Look up brands like Sinnis, Herald, AJS, Mash, Bullitt. Look up the Lexmoto Valiant and Tempest models. All these bikes looks pretty much the same with maybe different engines and parts used. Like mix match rojak of sorts. This would lead you to think it could be some truth that these are Chinese bikes made in the same factory then rebranded as another brand. If you play around with Alibaba you would notice that you can get the factory to customise bits and pieces or put your own custom logo on it if you buy above a certain MOQ. So all you need is to meet the MOQ and then inform the factory what you want to change or modify. So I guess this could also be categorised as a "custom bike" kinda? I guess?  I don't truly know any more  I can't 100% be certain but this does raise questions.

7) The google rating may be on the very high side, but most reviews/scores are based off folks' bike collection day, or initial/first impressions(like how I was smitten by everything initially). So those aren't really good indicators. Rather look into the UK reviews in YouTube and join the Mutt global owners group in FB. From there you can see the usual issues and make the a better informed decision. Or ask around actual owners who own the bike for more then 6 months. Who knows I might be the only having this issues and everyone else is fine with it.

8 ) The shop looks cool and I must say it's one of the better looking shops around but remember you buy the bike and not the shop so bike first, any other things are secondary. 

9) Folks here in SG riding Mutt, a lot of them are new riders so they may not have a lot to compare with in terms prior experience with other shops in SG or bike ownership. So they would naturally be blown aware with the shop decor, ambience, the bikes there and initial impressions, hence inflating the high reviews. So do bear that in mind.

10) Don't fall for the bike looks, look beyond it. Mutt bikes are like those old uncle Yamaha YBR 125s but dressed/revamped in cool eye Catching retro designs so just bear that in mind. So looks nice but performance wise you need manage your expectations, but again cheap and easy to maintain

Just my honest opinion and hope this helps folks on making an informed decision, all the best.

 

Edited September 24, 2023 by Rozvent
Typo and additional info.

[Rozvent]

To add context:

Mutt Razorback 250cc(machine price SGD$10,500 as at Dec 2022):

- Suzuki based/clone engine 250cc air cooled.

- Fuel injected.

- 5 speed transmission

- No slipper clutch

- Adjustable rear mono shock as stock

- ABS

- no brand brakes system

- Semi Digital Dash 

- Tubed Timsun brand Tires

- Led indicators and brake lights

- Halogen headlamp bulbs

- 10L fuel tank

- IU unit(custom wrapped)

- Full tank of fuel upon bike collection

- Full loaded cash card with custom Mutt decal upon bike collection 

- 2 year warranty or 20,000km warranty parts and labour.

- 1 year bike recovery foc

- No L shaped tire valves as stock

- No tpms as stock

- No voltmeter as stock

- No bar end mirror as stock

- Can put saddle bags or side panniers, top box but imo won't look nice.

- Simple owners manual good for beginners

- Basic tool kit(not very comprehensive).

- Vibrations at 100km above

- Top speed about 120km ish for me personally

- Not a comfy ride, but a head turner 100%

 

Zontes GK350(machine price SGD$10,600 as at May 2023):

- 350cc liquid cool single cylinder engine

- 6 speed transmission

- Slipper clutch as stock

- J.Juan brake system(this company was bought over by Brembo), including radial brake caliper at the front 

- Dual channel ABS

- Adjustable front brake and clutch levers as stock

- Adjustable rear mono shock as stock

- L shape tire valves as stock

- Full TFT display with 4 display modes, self adjusting brightness(like a mobile phone)

- Built in TPMS

- Built in Voltmeter

- Tubeless spoke rims(like those BMW bikes)

- CST brand tubeless tires

- Stock bar end mirrors

- Stock handlebar crash guards

- Stock crash bars

- Auto open Fuel cap

- Auto open Seat

- Full LED lighting systems(indicators, headlamps,brake lights)

- Illuminated handle bar switch gears as stock

- As stock, the ability to mirror whats on your phone screen over to the TFT dash display, so can run google maps this way too. So kinda don't need bike specific navigation devices

- 2 riding modes, eco and sports mode

- 17L fuel tank

- 1/2 bar of fuel during bike collection so have to top up asap after collecting your bike

- standard slim IU, no wrapping

- no cash card provided

- 3 year or 100,000km mileage engine warranty whichever comes first

- 2 years or 20,000km mileage electronics warranty whichever comes first

- Free Kappa top box with installation

- Owners manual provided(very detailed)

- Good tool kit provided

- Not much vibration and comfortable ride with better power in terms of acceleration and top speed

- Practical bike

- Zontes is known for touring (I have not done one personally though)

- Top speed for me personally 140km/h

 

Overall you get more bang for your buck with a Zontes vs a Mutt. Hence my main reason for selling off my mutt. It was also hard to sell of a Mutt as not many shops would buy them.